UgandanJoe
Novice DivisionMember is offline
Posts: 5
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 Posted: Aug 29th, 2010 at 11:14 pm
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Just to clear the air - and questions about my personal character and motivations....
I have never played in a tournament of any kind... I have rarely played in a league round. I usually avoid the public eye. Overall - I am a quiet person that will generally avoid conflict when given the choice. Also, in case there are any questions about my affiliations, I am a regular player that is NOT associated with the BDGA or the PDGA in any way.
As stated, I am a regular disc golf player in the Lexington area and I have resently heard some VERY disturbing things considering the course layout for Veterans Park!?!?
I want to be ANGRY!! I want to be calm... but it is hard to be either when I hear that the local 'association' that is in place to handle this scenario is not available to attend the local meetings that decide these parks and their future(LFUCG / Parks & Rec.). This begs the question...
"Is the position of the BDGA to manage the issues of the local courses for the Lexington area... or not?"
- - Or even better - -
"How long will local players allow for NO disc golf representation to appear at the LFUCG meetings?"
So - to cut to the chase... I'm not willing to criticise anyone & I'm also not willing to justify anyone.
WHAT I AM -
I am the individual who can represent the will of the BDGA & Common Sense to the public. I can force people to hear, or even better, to understand the entire scenario rather than only the mountain bikers at Veterans Park ... or the joggers at Shillito Park. There has been a large push from all sides to get what 'they want' from the LFUCG and the only people left out are Disc Golfers.
So basically what I need is support - I am NOT asking for permission... I am not asking for publicity... But I need other voices to show to the council. So I NEED your words!! I need something that I can take to the city council that is stronger than three bikers that want to change a TEN YEAR OLD COURSE because they don't want it there when they bike.
Show your support, tell other locals, get some support behind this and I will live up to my part. If I need to write a petition then I will... but not without support.
All I ask is for words that I can show the city council...something that can give me the voices to MAKE them pay attention.
BDGA - I am an independant voice, please, help me out!!
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Garcia
BDGA MemberMember is offline WhatEverItTakes
Posts: 322
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 Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 12:48 am
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I agree. There needs to be a show of support for the interests of the disc golf community. A light needs to be shed on the injustice we've received as far as the bike and walking trails are concerned.
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If that's what you're into.
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 04:38 am
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This is one of the things I have harped on for a while with people. If you want to be heard you need to actually speak up and in the case of local politics you need to be heard in numbers. Right now the LFUCG only sees the disc golf community that actually gives a crap as a few people. Why? Because only a handful of us have showed up to meetings and have voiced our opinion on the Mountain Bike/walking trails.
It's no big secret what going on, it's just that nobody was willing to take action.
The other point is that as far as Joe Public is concerned the Disc Golfers could care less about what happens to their courses, I mean heck they throw trash all over the place and vandalize their own courses.
That's how they see us folks.
Now I know there's a few of us that actually step up and take care of the courses but there's an emphasis on the word few here. This has been the case for years and years and years.
This year has been very rough on the BDGA this year and me in particular being the President and having to take the brunt of everything. So far on my plate I have been dealing with the City with Shillito and the mess there and now Veterans Park which is now in the bidding stage for the contracting. Not to mention City Counsel meetings to get 2 more courses in in Lexington and....running a buttload of tournaments and leagues.
Do we need a hand? Heck yea we do! The problem is is that we all have real jobs and families outside of this hobby called disc golf. I totally understand that. But in order to maintain and improve the sport and to keep the city from rolling over us we need to organize together as a large entity that actually stands out. Not just a handful of officers and a handful of club members. Numbers wise the BDGA is the minority here.
This isn't a rally to get people to join the club its a rally to get disc golfers in the area to give a crap and stand up and actually do something.
Anyhoo enough typing for now as , I have to get ready for work (one of the 2 actual paying jobs I have) I'll chime in again when I get home later. 
Drew
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daniel
Recreational DivisionMember is offline
Posts: 88
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 07:34 am
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What's happening at Vets? A redesign due to the Mtn bikers/walkers?
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Bigdaddy Lewis
BDGA Officers Member is offline Have a Nice Day
Posts: 1,130
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 08:42 am
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Joe - come to the BDGA meetings (dates always announced in the forum) and you'll see what's being done - as stated in Jerry's post above. There is a developing relationship between the DG community and the local parks/council decision makers - and we are taking questions, ideas, concerns and discussions through appropriate channels as you can see.
The BDGA is very active on this issue - trust me. In the last 12 months their work has included the installation of course at River Hill, the design/redesign/re-redesign battles with Shillito and Vets, as well as the design work and financial discussions at Jscobsen and at Coldstream Farm. All by volunteers. Not to mention the course maintenance which often falls to us - as well as tournament and league administration and disc ordering for all of those events - often with officers donating their own money to ensure a good payout.
BDGA meeting dates are always announced through this forum and open to all - whether a BDGA member or not. Come find out how much work is being done.
« Last Edited by
Bigdaddy Lewis
Aug 30th, 2010 at 08:45 am »
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daniel
Recreational DivisionMember is offline
Posts: 88
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 07:01 pm
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So, what's going to happen with the affected holes? New holes added or just a redesign? I wouldn't mind the "original" #2 back. That was a challenging shot, even if it was short...
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DarellM
BDGA MemberMember is offline
Posts: 283
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 09:00 pm
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I spent 60 hours clearing the new #2 location, and payed one of my employees forty hours, along with some other help, I cant believe they are taking that one,
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UgandanJoe
Novice DivisionMember is offline
Posts: 5
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Posted: Aug 30th, 2010 at 09:16 pm
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Wow... I guess a whole day is a bit long to wait before checking back in on the forum...
To answer this politely I think I will have to go through comments person by person. Otherwise, something I write as a response to one person might be misconstrued by another.
Garcia - Thanks for the support!!
Drew - I can totally understand where you (and the club) are coming from: especially when a lot of people talk about "the way things should be" but very few people actually make an effort. I get it. What I can say is that I have never said I would trim bushes, mow back the tall grass or even work a league event.
However, the point of my post is not to inspire change in anything that the league is working on or even to involve the name 'BDGA' in my statements to the city council (I think I mis-spoke when I said that I wanted to "represent the will of the BDGA to the public" - what I want is the support of BDGA members). From my point of view, the BDGA is a club in every form and has no reason to be heard as a "group" because they do not speak for the disc golfers in Lexington... they are only a select group of golfers within a larger group. It may even be easier to represent the public rather than the club because a club can have motivations beyond a general group, and those motives are none of my concern.
J.Dob - I agree entirely!! A strong statement is the point. However, I can write the statement and present it at the city council. My issue is getting voices of the general public to "jump in" with it. I can show up - be polite - read my statement and then hear what they have to say about it... all while being ignored and pushed to the side as a 'single' voice. But if I walk in the door - politely read my statement and mention that this statement is supported by 2000 local disc golfers that all frequent the park in question then my words are not words. They are a rally of people who do not want a park changed because three bikers don't want to drive to Raven Run.
Lewis - I feel like you may have missed my point and my position. As a golfer in the area, I do not see this as a League issue... it is a community issue. In fact, the relocation of holes due to the city council not viewing the 'whole' picture was brought to my attention from someone who is not in the BDGA. Similar to what I mentioned above, my goal is not to stand in front of the city and simply say that I have the support of the BDGA. I need the support of local golfers - this forum just happens to be a quick way to contact a few dozen. 
The additions of Jacobson and Coldstream would be amazing! This post is not a comment about the activity of the club - honestly, this is not a club issue. However, the addition of new courses has nothing to do with the facts at hand. There is no reason to alter an existing course at Veteran's Park. Especially when Veterans Park already has over 12 miles of biking path... not to mention that they already ignore our existence and bike through our golf course, so why should we be told to change anything? The entire position is ludicrous because the city has temporarily approved it based on only one proposal - basically ignoring the fact that the other group exists.
Also, please don't take my comments negatively... I'm just trying to focus this on my main point. However, I will not be planning a visit to the club meetings... I do not ask for the 'clubs' support, I am asking for the individual support of its members. If an officer of said club thinks his members should support the statement ('DO NOT FORCE CHANGE AT VETERANS') I plan to make, they should represent it to them.
* SO THIS MIGHT CLEAR UP QUESTIONS *
I realized that there is no reason to trust anything about me when this is only my second post on your forum... so here you are.
My name is William (Will) Hart and I have been playing disc golf for roughly 5 years. I have never played in a PDGA sanctioned event. I have been to the BDGA League nights... some of you know me from there (Drew, J Dob), but I have never been a paid member of the club itself.
To answer questions about my speaking, writing & knowledge:
I have recently received my Master of Architecture. My focus is in building design although I have also spent time working in programming and interactive design. Having a Masters Degree, I have written many papers on a wide variety of topics and have even won an award for my writing.
As a speaker, I have presented my work in Dubai, UAE and Rome, Italy, as well as having presented in front of many world renown architects and businessmen.
To close: I apologize for the length. I will make an effort to check this forum more often in the future so things do not back up so much.
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Posted: Aug 31st, 2010 at 10:52 am
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Will,
The main thing I don't want to happen would be the feeling of the general disc golf public is that anything that happens to Veterans change wise is the BDGA's fault. We have tried to work with the LFUCG the best we could to at least get something out of this deal as in new Teesigns/posts, new tee pads for the rest of the holes and new stairs for hole 6-7 , all paid for by parks and rec. And yes as James told me last night it does seem like they are paying us off. But at least we are getting something as opposed to nothing as has occurred in the past.
I strongly encourage you and everyone else to voice your opinions on this matter but like I said, the reason this whole deal has come this far is because;
1) the disc golf community simply doesn't get involved in whats going on around them.
2) as the main focal point of disc golf in the community the BDGA simply doesn't have the numbers of caring individuals that it needs to stand up to the city on issues like this. The best that we have been able to do in the cases of Shillito and Veterans park is to have the chance to work with them as so that they don't simply destroy completely what we have worked so hard to obtain in the first place or blindly cause more issues with the general public.(and don't get me started up about the Shillito walking trail again)
Now here is where I stand.
As the President of the BDGA I stand in a spot where I am the main communications with the City. All of my decisions are based upon what the general disc golf community (those who stand up and represent) state to me. I don't/can't base my decisions on what I alone want to do as I am bound by the bylaws of the club. I represent all of you guys when it comes to dealing with Joe Public.
Now then,
As Lewis said,
If you don't show up to the meetings and so on how are you going to know what is going on and on the flip side how is the city going to know what you all feel if you stay silent.
That being said, Will do what you feel needs to be done by letting them know how you feel and how others feel on the matter. Maybe it'll make a difference maybe it won't but we'll never know if you don't take the action in the first place. And trust me they have already heard it from me, but like I said others need to let them know they feel the same way in a polite manner (if that's possible)
Now for the bad guy Drew part;
I have to continue to work on the project. Right now it's in the bidding stage for all the contracting. I got an email that they are going to order the materials for the new pins and sign posts. The reason they are moving this fast is that when you are dealing with city projects they take for ever due to all the contracting and budgets and so on. If I drop the project it can all go to poopville on us very quickly. If they feel that the BDGA is working against them they may cut us out of this and future projects.
That is what worries me the most.
It doesn't mean you can't or shouldn't speak up on the matter. All it means is that the ball is rolling and unless something drastic happens the project is going to continue as is.
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LLSDG
BDGA Officers Member is offline HARDCORE
Posts: 777
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Posted: Aug 31st, 2010 at 11:48 am
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Here's a few things to add to whats been said. We have tried and tried to get things accomplished and as a club we have taken it upon ourselves to try and work with the parks to come to a mutual decisions. Every time it seems that we have come to a a mutual beneficial conclusion on anything the exact opposite happens and we end up taking the brunt of everything negative. The biggest problem is that LFUCG just doesn't care about what goes on because disc golf currently doesn't help their image. I have had I don't know how many people from the LFUCG simply just lie to my face to get me to stop complaining. I met with the deputy director to get things cleaned up for a tournament that we were running at Shillito. He said it would be done the next day. I had to make over 30 calls to just get them to come remove trees that they cut down not to mention the equipment that was parked in the fairway until 2 days before the event. We have tried on several occasions to try and meet with the LFUCG (Jerry actually did once) but everything that was discussed was for not cause once again they are making us move something that has been established for over 9 years. I still call to try to see what can be done but the only response you can get is "we will try to work with you to resolve these issues" which in political speech means I'll tell what ever you want to hear and let it continue as-is. As an officer of the BDGA we frankly have no power over whats going on. You have my support to go before the LFUCG and voice your opinions cause honestly our diplomatic means of dealing with this has repeatedly flopped.
I tell everyone that I ever hear complaining to please call the Urban Count Government and please tell them exactly what you think. Maybe if we get a few hundred more people angry just maybe something might get worked out.
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Roger
BDGA MemberMember is offline statesman
Posts: 354
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Posted: Aug 31st, 2010 at 08:35 pm
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WOW!
I take a leave of absence for 4 months and everything goes flippin' crazy.
Don't everyone faint when I say this, but I STAND WITH THE BDGA. I also believe that this Will person has a right to speak his opinions in front of the LFUCG, and I agree with him. However, his opinions should in no way be considered representation of this club. Though we may agree with him in most instances, I will hold him to his word that he acts alone, and does not at any time reflect upon this club his greivance(s) in their presence. If he hasn't the desire to participate in club meetings, that is his decision, and hey it's cool, but again I just want to be clear here when I say again: He represents himself and anyone who stands with him, but he does not represent this club. Give em' hell man!
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DarellM
BDGA MemberMember is offline
Posts: 283
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Posted: Aug 31st, 2010 at 09:05 pm
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I dont understand, maybe the redesign will be better, I've never seen or heard much about it, is the only place you find out anything is the meetings?
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Garcia
BDGA MemberMember is offlineWhatEverItTakes
Posts: 322
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Posted: Sep 1st, 2010 at 02:07 am
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All of you have made great points. Drew, Landon and Roger are all right on point.
I know this is slightly off topic, but Darrel's point stands out to me. It's a really good point. You guys keep saying to Will (and everyone else) that if you want to know what's going on, then you should go to the meetings. I'm not sure if this is right. Isn't that what these forums are for? Aren't these issues meant to be discussed and/or debated here? Isn't what happens in the meetings supposed to get shared in the meetings section of these forums anyway?
Will, you have my support as well.
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If that's what you're into.
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daniel
Recreational DivisionMember is offline
Posts: 88
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Posted: Sep 1st, 2010 at 09:07 am
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I'd say no, the business meetings of the club are very important. There are things that really shouldn't be put up on the boards for obvious reasons that are said in the meetings. In other words, you'll get some of the message and info if you read here, but not the whole thing that you would if you attended the meetings.
Just my $0.02.
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Posted: Sep 1st, 2010 at 09:59 am
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Sep 1st, 2010 at 09:07 am, daniel wrote:
I'd say no, the business meetings of the club are very important. There are things that really shouldn't be put up on the boards for obvious reasons that are said in the meetings. In other words, you'll get some of the message and info if you read here, but not the whole thing that you would if you attended the meetings.
Just my $0.02.
Not only that but Meetings are the best platform for live discussion on important matters.
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ANYONE willing to stand up to LFUCG? : - - - YOU NEED TO READ THIS - - - - (Read 1,860 Times)
